12 Questions with Top Copywriter Ryan Healy

Special treat today…

I’ve been following copywriter Ryan Healy closely for a couple of years now. He’s a very bright guy and always generous with the good stuff. He’s been doing this interview series on his blog. He shares a 12 question interview with other writers and direct response marketers with the idea of helping us all learn how to achieve more success.

Cool idea. Here’s my interview with Ryan. You can see his interview with me here.

Enjoy.

1. As you know, Ryan, storytelling rules in copy. And you use it to great effect. In that spirit, tell me how you met your wife and the moment you knew she was “the one”. (My wife and I are celebrating our 10th anniversary today, so I’m feeling a bit sappy.)

Back in high school I worked at a snowboard shop. We sold snowboards, skateboards, inline skates… and basically all the stuff that goes along with those sports.

Anyway, I was the only Christian where I worked. My co-worker Chad was friends with Julie, a girl who worked next door at Guiry’s. Julie worked with a Christian girl named Stephanie. And Stephanie was the only Christian who worked at Guiry’s.

So Chad and Julie are talking one day and figure out, “Hey, Ryan is a Christian and Stephanie is a Christian. They should date!”

This discovery sent Chad and Julie into action. Chad kept prodding me every day to “go meet the Christian girl next door.” Somehow, the logic was lost on me. I declined.

One day Julie had a barbecue and Chad was there. My co-worker Brian and I were holding down the fort at Rocky Mountain Snowboards. Chad called us up from Julie’s apartment and invited us over.

So we closed down the shop, spent a couple hours skateboarding, and then headed over to the barbecue for some free food.

Turns out Stephanie was also at the barbecue. She knew I was the Christian guy from the snowboard shop. But I didn’t know she was the Christian girl from Guiry’s.

I tried talking to her, but she was kind of quiet and seemed uncomfortable.

Then her boyfriend walked in.

He looked like “Steve” from Beverly Hills 90210.

After a couple minutes, I bowed out of the conversation.

But that wasn’t the last I was to see of Stephanie. She broke up with her boyfriend that same week, then came over to Rocky Mountain Snowboards to ask me out on a date.

Of course, she came over under the pretense that Julie needed to talk to Chad… a convenient cover for her true motive.

This time, Stephanie looked like a totally different girl. She was smiling and seemed really radiant. Of course, I said yes… and the rest is history.

I started dating Stephanie when I was 18. I can’t point to a precise moment, but it didn’t take long before I knew she was “the one.” After dating for a year, we set a date to get married.

I got married when I was 20… and we’ve now enjoyed more than a decade of pure marital bliss (well, almost pure).

2. Do you find time to write much outside of copy?

Not as much as I’d like to. I used to write a lot of poetry, but in recent years I’ve lacked the inspiration I had as an angst-filled teenager.

And I guess there’s still a part of me that would like to write a novel at some point. Not pulp fiction or anything like that. If I write a book, I want to write literature.

3. Do you ever write to music, or are you one of those “complete silence” guys?

I go back and forth. If the music distracts me from my writing, I turn it off. But a lot of times, music seems to be my fuel.

Right now, as I write this, I’m listening to Matisyahu’s new album “Lights.”

Some of my favorite writing music is by the Scandinavian “group” Amethystium. (I say “group” because it’s just one guy.)

When it’s snowing, I like to put on Loreena McKennitt.

And when I want to get pumped up, I’ll put on something like Switchfoot, Linkin Park, or TobyMac’s “Portable Sounds.”

My dad used to get mad at me when I would do my homework while listening to music. So I think that encouraged me from a young age to listen to music while I work.

I actually used to try to sing along to songs sung in English while reading and writing in German. I discovered it can be done, but I don’t recommend it.

4. We all talk about our business influences, but what artists inspire your work?

Actually, it’s hard to say which artists directly inspire my work, although it’s easy to tell you which artists inspire me in general.

As you might have guessed from my response above, I love music. I’m often inspired by songs and lyrics. A lot of U2′s music inspires me, as well as some Christian artists like Jars of Clay, Tree63, Rush of Fools, and Tenth Avenue North.

I also love literature. John Steinbeck, Fyodor Dostoevsky, Edith Wharton, Tim O’Brien… I could write you a long list of great authors I love.

As far as poetry goes, I’m fond of Billy Collins. This last year I read Sailing Alone Around the Room and really enjoyed it.

I also love Dylan Thomas’s “Do Not Go Gentle into that Good Night” and “The Force that Through the Green Fuse Drives the Flower.”

Ultimately, my work is inspired by different influences at different times, and each individual influence is difficult to trace. We are the sum total of all our thoughts and experiences up until the present time.

5. It’s bizarre (or not, perhaps) how many top copywriters play guitar. Do you play an instrument?

Actually, I love to sing.

I like to stand in front of my Bose Wave stereo and just sing along to my favorite songs, sometimes for an hour or more. I also sing in my car, people staring or not.

That said, I have in the past played guitar and saxophone.

6. I got to hear Dave Lakhani speak briefly at SANG III last week. That cat has ‘nads of steel. He demonstrated his theory that “only polarized people buy”. I noticed you tend to show your colors politically and religiously when the common rule of biz is to avoid those subjects like a crazy ex-girlfriend. What effect has speaking up about your beliefs had on your biz?

What a great question…

Actually, the business impact of sharing my beliefs is hard to measure because beliefs are one of those “soft influences” that can’t be measured in clicks, dollars, or conversion rates.

I will say that my willingness to polarize people has generated some intense discussions on my blog. And some of my clients and customers really resonate with my views.

So even though it’s a tenuous connection, I’d venture that my openness has had a financially positive effect on my business.

7. If you had to choose one, would you rather your kids become copywriters, politicians or evangelists?

You might as well have asked me which poison I’d choose to give my kids!

The year 1776 was a good year for politics, but it’s been downhill ever since. I’ve long said that you’d have to be crazy to become a career politician today, and since I wish sanity on all my children, politics is out.

I have nothing wrong with evangelism, but I have a big problem with modern career evangelists, particularly in the U.S.

I wouldn’t shed a tear if the mega churches, the slick televangelists, and the Christian prosperity gospel all went the way of the dinosaur.

So I guess it really depends on what you mean by evangelist. In my opinion, evangelism shouldn’t be a career choice, but rather something you do when God presents an opportunity for you to share your faith.

Paul was a tentmaker, not an evangelist. He preached the good news of Jesus Christ in his spare time. That’s an approach to evangelism I can get behind.

Which leaves copywriting.

So by default, I think I’d rather my kids became copywriters than politicians or evangelists.

8. Rank the first 5 amendments to the U.S. Constitution in order of importance to you. If you could add your own amendment, what would it be?

I’d rank the first five Amendments in order of importance to me as follows: 1, 2, 4, 5, 3.

The only reason I’ve moved Amendment 3 to the back of the line is because I think it would be far easier to host a soldier in my house than submit to an unlawful search and seizure of my property, or to allow the government to take my property without just compensation.

If I could add my own Amendment, it would be to concisely define the role of the federal government so it would not exceed its lawful reach. Many years ago, I wrote the following:

“To adequately protect our nation from the government, we must first define the role of government, and then confine the boundaries of its sprawl. If one understands that the politician is merely a businessman whose goal is to grow his business, and the only way for him to grow his business is to increase taxation and clamor to special interest groups, one will also understand why these controls are so vital to our nation’s well-being. One must never forget that politicians are also capitalists.”

In my opinion, the federal government should be primarily involved in the creation, interpretation, and enforcement of laws; the maintenance of a sound currency; foreign affairs; defense; and interstate transportation. (This is off the top of my head, so I may be forgetting something.)

The federal governement should NOT be involved in providing health care, retirement planning, paying farmers to kick it on the homestead, funding special interest groups, etc etc etc ad nauseam.

9. I know you’ve coached quite a few copywriters, what do you find is the biggest hurdle rookies face when writing to sell?

I believe the biggest hurdle is the tendency toward hype. My definition of hype is “promise without proof.”

Many new copywriters like to make lots of big promises, but then forget to back them up. What they end up with is a bunch of empty claims which are not likely to persuade anybody to buy anything.

Another common problem I see is in word choice and the poor use of tone. A lot of newbie copywriters are immature, and they sound that way when they write. Unfortunately, teaching “tone” is one of those things that is very difficult.

10. How do you split your production time these days? What activity provides the best ROI in your biz?

I probably divide my productive time about 75/25. I spend about 75% of my productive time on client work and 25% on my own projects.

What activity provides the best ROI in my business? Well, if I was better at tracking everything I do, I could tell you!

If I had to make an educated guess, I’d say that both writing copy and improving marketing processes for my clients is up there in terms of ROI.

I also find it profitable to maintain good business relationships, overdeliver whenever I can, and do the little things that count — because all of this leads to more referrals. And I’ve found referrals to be an excellent source of new business for me.

11. How do you see the biz of copy changing over the next 3-5 years?

Hard to say, Kevin. If the recent FTC changes are any indication, I’d expect to see more laws governing what advertisements can and cannot say. And I’d expect advertisers and copywriters to quickly adapt to whatever new requirements may come along.

I also expect there to be less and less clarity about what really works to increase conversions. The reason I say this is because there is virtually no end to what you can put on your sales pages.

Copy. Audio. Video. Graphics. Images. Captions. Buttons. Seals. Badges. Countdown timers. Exit pops. Etc.

And to this digital buffet more options are being added all the time.

All is to say, I feel like there will be fewer clear-cut answers five years from now — and more questions than ever.

Because of this, I feel like it will become imperative for copywriters to understand marketing and sales psychology inside and out. It will also become imperative to always be testing.

12. If money is no object, what’s your most frivolous goal in life?

I wouldn’t mind owning a condo or cabin in Summit County as a base for indulging my penchant for mountain recreation: snowboarding, cycling, mountain biking, and hiking.

I don’t know if that qualifies as a goal or not, but there it is.

Where can people learn more about you, Ryan?

The best place to engage me is on my blog.

I usually post new articles a couple times a week depending on how close client deadlines are looming.

If you like marketing lessons mixed with “taboo” subjects nobody else wants to talk about, then you’ll fit right in.

And just in case you can be bribed, you should know I offer a free “Conversion Booster Check List” to anybody who joins my email list.

Check out my blog here: www.RyanHealy.com